Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1T5YCKI8Y000H3T@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:53 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.175]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 13:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from modem-21.red-naped-sapsucker.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.208.21] helo=vaio) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14j3rp-00078t-00 for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 19:43:26 +0100 Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 19:52:03 +0100 From: Mark Turner Subject: Re: W-EMED PJs Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <001701c0b94a$9cb4ffc0$15d0893e@vaio> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: <3b.1282e09b.27f50704@aol.com> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable So far 4 PJs from the 321st Special Tactics Squadron baised at RAF = Mildenhall, England, have done the WEMT course which we have run in = Britain. We are running another course this year and they have been in = contact regarding sending PJs on it. Best regards Mark Turner Combat Medical Technician RAMC Eqt & logistics Officer European Faculty WEMSI ----- Original Message -----=20 From: DCLinn@aol.com=20 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 10:45 PM Subject: W-EMED PJs Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the=20 advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the battlefield is much = different=20 today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of = casualties. From=20 an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get=20 "clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far = from=20 definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of = multiple=20 low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of = getting=20 "clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. When they get = "clobbered",=20 search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, = especially=20 television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even = small=20 numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political = disaster.=20 So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured = from=20 remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care = to=20 remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long = distances to=20 tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great = expense and=20 effort to save even one life these days.=20 The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air = Force. =20 They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more = wilderness=20 medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue = can be=20 found on the web site www.pararescue.com .=20 IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician=20 extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training = and no=20 physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are=20 authorized to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also = trained to=20 recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that = person to=20 definitive care. However, with the exception a few special IDMTs, = they=20 don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine. The PJ job would be much = more=20 interesting to most of the users of this forum.=20 David Linn, MD=20 Emergency Physician and EMS Director=20 WPAFB, OH=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
So far 4 PJs from the 321st Special = Tactics=20 Squadron baised at RAF Mildenhall, England, have done the WEMT = course which=20 we have run in Britain.  We are running another course this year = and they=20 have been in contact regarding sending PJs on it.
 
 
Best regards
 
Mark Turner
Combat Medical Technician
RAMC
Eqt & logistics Officer European = Faculty=20 WEMSI
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 DCLinn@aol.com
To: wilderness-emergency-= medicine@list.pitt.edu=20
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2001 = 10:45=20 PM
Subject: W-EMED PJs

Yes Bob a = lot has=20 changed in military medicine since Korea, given the
advances in = medicine=20 and SAR. Furthermore, the  battlefield is much different =
today, and=20 today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From =
an=20 American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get=20
"clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and = far=20 from
definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting = of=20 multiple
low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at = risk of=20 getting
"clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. =  When they=20 get "clobbered",
search and rescue usually becomes paramount. = Advances in=20 media, especially
television, mean that public opinion will no = longer=20 tolerate even small
numbers of casualties, and just one fatality = can be a=20 political disaster.

So great advances have been made in the = ability to=20 extract the injured from
remote "battlefields", quickly project = definitive=20 salvage trauma care to
remote locations, and then fly critically = injured=20 patients long distances to
tertiary care medical centers. The US = military=20 will go to great expense and
effort to save even one life these = days.=20

The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of = the Air=20 Force.  
They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is = much more=20 wilderness
medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info = about=20 pararescue can be
found on the web site www.pararescue.com . =

IDMTs=20 are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician =
extenders=20 to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no=20
physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and = are=20
authorized  to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are = also=20 trained to
recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and = evacuate=20 that person to
definitive care.  However, with the exception = a few=20 special IDMTs,  they
don't do much SAR or wilderness = medicine.=20  The PJ job would be much more
interesting to most of the = users of=20 this forum.

David Linn, MD
Emergency Physician and EMS = Director=20
WPAFB, OH ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C0B952.E4937620-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:06:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1SWATCLJ4000D5U@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:06:50 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:04:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.14.) id h.5b.13f7c0e4 (4565) for ; Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:03:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2001 09:03:58 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Medics & Up to speed Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are NREMT-Bs and treat all patients equally at the EMT-B level but they do start IVs which in New Jersey we do not as New Jersey EMT-Bs. They operate inder a more "national protocol". Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are NREMT-Bs and treat all patients equally at the EMT-B
level but they do start IVs which in New Jersey we do not as New Jersey
EMT-Bs.  They operate inder a more "national protocol".

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_5b.13f7c0e4.27f5ec4e_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1RY3GE1K600S0HD@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:47:22 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:46:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m10.mx.aol.com (imo-m10.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.165]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:46:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from DCLinn@aol.com by imo-m10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.14.) id h.3b.1282e09b (3874) for ; Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:45:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2001 16:45:40 -0500 (EST) From: DCLinn@aol.com Subject: W-EMED PJs Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3b.1282e09b.27f50704@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10501 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the battlefield is much different today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get "clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far from definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of multiple low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of getting "clobbered" are the pilots and special operators. When they get "clobbered", search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, especially television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even small numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political disaster. So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured from remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care to remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long distances to tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great expense and effort to save even one life these days. The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air Force. They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more wilderness medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue can be found on the web site www.pararescue.com . IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are authorized to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also trained to recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that person to definitive care. However, with the exception a few special IDMTs, they don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine. The PJ job would be much more interesting to most of the users of this forum. David Linn, MD Emergency Physician and EMS Director WPAFB, OH --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes Bob a lot has changed in military medicine since Korea, given the
advances in medicine and SAR. Furthermore, the  battlefield is much different
today, and today's media gives folks at home a clear view of casualties. From
an American perspective, today's serviceman or woman is likely to get
"clobbered" anywhere in the world, usually without much notice and far from
definitive medical care. In today's battlefield, consisting of multiple
low-intensity conflicts all over the world, those most at risk of getting
"clobbered" are the pilots and special operators.  When they get "clobbered",
search and rescue usually becomes paramount. Advances in media, especially
television, mean that public opinion will no longer tolerate even small
numbers of casualties, and just one fatality can be a political disaster.

So great advances have been made in the ability to extract the injured from
remote "battlefields", quickly project definitive salvage trauma care to
remote locations, and then fly critically injured patients long distances to
tertiary care medical centers. The US military will go to great expense and
effort to save even one life these days.

The first link in this chain are the PJs, or pararescue, of the Air Force.  
They usually are not IDMTs, but have a job that is much more wilderness
medicine and SAR oriented than the IDMTs. More info about pararescue can be
found on the web site www.pararescue.com .

IDMTs are usually not battlefield medics but rather act as physician
extenders to remote locations where people are stationed or training and no
physician is available. They treat minor injuries and colds and are
authorized  to give out motrin, antibiotics etc. IDMTs are also trained to
recognize and stabilize serious injury/illness and evacuate that person to
definitive care.  However, with the exception a few special IDMTs,  they
don't do much SAR or wilderness medicine.  The PJ job would be much more
interesting to most of the users of this forum.

David Linn, MD
Emergency Physician and EMS Director
WPAFB, OH --part1_3b.1282e09b.27f50704_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:03:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1QSQ5T6H800RFUJ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:03:05 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from briseis.worthy.com (root@cpe-bworthy-56kbrstbl.wireless.mt.net [206.127.112.30]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:02:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from worthy.com ([206.127.79.66]) by briseis.worthy.com (8.9.0/8.9.0) with ESMTP id TAA06001 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:23:02 -0700 Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:06:58 -0700 From: Bob Worthy Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC298C2.979E5355@worthy.com> Organization: Key Computer Consultants, Inc. MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en References: <33.12ad34c1.27f367c1@aol.com> Along this topic, I thought this might be of interest. At a used book sale recently I bought _Back Down the Ridge_, W.L. White, 1953, Harcourt, Brace and Company, 182 pages. The jacket blurb says, "The story of what happens to the men who get "clobbered" in Korea." This is a very well written book, very informative. Author's Note Ch 1: How you get Clobbered Ch 2: Down Off the Ridge Ch 3: Your Litter Goes Through a Mash Ch 4: So They Open You Up Ch 5: The Valley of the Shadow Ch 6: Headed State-Side Ch 7: The Enemy and Our Allies: A Litter-Level View Ch 8: So Now you Limp Off Epilogue: The Next Wave It would be interesting to hear how much has changed since 1953. It would appear that huge advances were made in Korea in battlefield care. -- Bob Worthy bworthy@worthy.com http://www.worthy.com/ 406 439 0986 v See Lewis and Clark SAR new http://www.lcsar.com/ Visit new searchable index on Search and Rescue, http://www.worthy.com/sarsearch/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1QQ9IQH8O00S0DN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:52:24 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:51:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from web6303.mail.yahoo.com (web6303.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.22.140]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 19:51:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from [165.76.25.94] by web6303.mail.yahoo.com; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:51:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:51:48 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <20010327204923.61686.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010329005148.10078.qmail@web6303.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk Some have been certified as EMT-P but we are only required to be EMT-B --- Morgan Young wrote: > are they NREMT-Paramedic certified or other? > > > --- Trevor wrote: > > IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a > > quarter and attend refresher courses > > annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care > > areas. All are also NREMT > > certified. We attend conferences and workshops like > > other medical professionals. We > > just work in a different spectrum when we are > > deployed. We just dont get paid as well as > > "Medical Professionals" > > > > Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT > > Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor > > > > > > --- Andy wrote: > > > This has piqued my interest. > > > > > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and > > IDC's > > > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How > > do > > > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > > > during deployments? > > > > > > Andy Thornton > > > > > > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express > > permission. > > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > > Submissions To: > > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > > Do not reproduce without author's express > > permission. > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > ===== > Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P > theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address > My ICQ Number is13139183. > The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. > -Joseph Heller > "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q86QMWJK00S0DN@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:46 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com (imo-m03.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from GaidenMstr@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.33.12ad34c1 (9251) for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:13:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:13:53 -0500 (EST) From: GaidenMstr@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <33.12ad34c1.27f367c1@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10519 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ladies and Gentlemen, The primary purpose of the Independent Duty Corpsman (IDC), Independent Duty Medical Technician (IDMT) and the Special Forces Medical Sergeant (SFMS also known as an 18D) are to care for military personnel at remote sites. Some of these same independent duty medics have to be able treat and try to keep the patients stabilized for up to 72 hours before they can be evacuated from their site (ship, remote fixed site or in the middle of a jungle). These personnel must also be able to provide primary clinical care, public health/ preventive health services, and emergency dental care. One could not truely categorize them as just EMTs but rather non-traditional healthcare clinicians; furthermore, they are much more different than the basic military medic as described by an individual in earlier posting. If one was to describe the duties of the general populace, he or she would have to say that these individuals are public health technicians, intermediate to advanced nurses, primary care clinicians, and EMT-Intermediate to EMT-Paramedics. You could say that they are a jack-of-all-trades with some of them certified as NREMT basics through paramedic levels; however, just because they are EMT-Basics doesn't mean that they function at that level becuase they function at a higher level to include ACLS roles. Well, I have been on my soap box long enough and will close. If you any of you non-military medics want to talk more about this without holding up other forum posts please feel free to talk to me offline. Take care. Robert A. McCumsey Robert A. McCumsey MSgt, USAF IDMT, EMT-P NCOIC, Joint SOF Medical Education & Training Division U.S. Special Operations Command/ SOCS-SG 7701 Tampa Point Blvd MacDill AFB, FL 33621 Telephone: (813) 828-5043 Fax: (813) 828-2568 --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ladies and Gentlemen,

      The primary purpose of the Independent Duty Corpsman (IDC),
Independent Duty Medical Technician (IDMT) and the Special Forces Medical
Sergeant (SFMS also known as an 18D) are to care for military personnel at
remote sites.  Some of these same independent duty medics have to be able
treat and try to keep the patients stabilized for up to 72 hours before they
can be evacuated from their site (ship, remote fixed site or in the middle of
a jungle).  These personnel must also be able to provide primary clinical
care, public health/ preventive health services,  and emergency dental care.  
One could not truely categorize them as just EMTs but rather non-traditional
healthcare clinicians; furthermore, they are much more different than the
basic military medic as described by an individual in earlier posting.

      If one was to describe the duties of the general populace, he or she
would have to say that these individuals are public health technicians,
intermediate to advanced nurses, primary care clinicians, and
EMT-Intermediate to EMT-Paramedics.  You could say that they are a
jack-of-all-trades with some of them certified as NREMT basics through
paramedic levels; however, just because they are EMT-Basics doesn't mean that
they function at that level becuase they function at a higher level to
include ACLS roles.  

      Well, I have been on my soap box long enough and will close.  If you
any of you non-military medics want to talk more about this without holding
up other forum posts please feel free to talk to me offline.  Take care.


Robert A. McCumsey
Robert A. McCumsey
MSgt, USAF
IDMT, EMT-P
NCOIC, Joint SOF Medical Education & Training Division
U.S. Special Operations Command/ SOCS-SG

7701 Tampa Point Blvd
MacDill AFB, FL 33621

Telephone: (813) 828-5043
Fax: (813) 828-2568 --part1_33.12ad34c1.27f367c1_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q80I8R6S0004NO@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:44 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp5vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.26]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron (adsl-141-151-143-199.pittpa.adsl.bellatlantic.net [141.151.143.199]) by smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA18427529 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:16:49 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:22 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED subscriber information Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC1C662.12520.543A09@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk Information for W-EMED subscribers can be found on the Web at: http://www.pitt.edu/~postman/lists/majordomo-basic.html Thank you. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1Q80LVVR600RSH0@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:49 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (smtp5vepub.gte.net [206.46.170.26]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron (adsl-141-151-143-199.pittpa.adsl.bellatlantic.net [141.151.143.199]) by smtp5ve.mailsrvcs.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA16795436 for ; Wed, 28 Mar 2001 16:16:50 +0000 (GMT) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 11:05:13 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: W-EMED reminder -- restricted posting Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3AC1C569.11454.506B74@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk As of a few days ago, only those email addresses actually s u b s c r i b e d to the list can post to the list. This will not eliminate spam -- someone can join and post spam (although I will delete them from the list). However, it should cut down on the spam quite a bit. If you find that you need to post from another address than that under which you're s u b s c r i b e d, please s u b s c r i b e that other address, too. Thank you --Keith Conover, listowner --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:44:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1PBNUJS8O0004SK@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:44:03 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:43:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.memlane.com (mail.memlane.com [199.185.225.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 19:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from name ([199.185.225.226]) by mail.memlane.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-55152U3000L300S0V35) with SMTP id com for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 17:42:46 -0700 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 17:37:42 -0700 From: Donovan Hoggan Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000b01c0b71f$4de81b20$e2e1b9c7@name> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk References: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello again, I just wanted to thank everyone for the overwhelming response to my = question. I still need to consult with the rest of the team, but I = think we're going to include NP airways in the kit. Thanks again. Donovan Hoggan ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello = again,
 
I just wanted to = thank everyone=20 for the overwhelming response to my question.  I still need to = consult=20 with the rest of the team, but I think we're going to include NP = airways in=20 the kit.
 
Thanks = again.
 
Donovan=20 Hoggan
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C0B6E4.A09FCD80-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1P3KH34A800PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from web9609.mail.yahoo.com (web9609.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.188]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from [205.182.107.178] by web9609.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:52:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:52:02 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Young Subject: Re: W-EMED Is there a Digest In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327205202.15726.qmail@web9609.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk I wish, but this is the most traffic I have seen on this list. --- TANMAN wrote: > Is there a Digest form for Wilderness Medicine? > > And can you give the instructions? > > Thanks, > > > > Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email > > Albuquerque, New Mexico > __________________________________________________________________ > > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ===== Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address My ICQ Number is13139183. The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. -Joseph Heller "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1P3HKR53O0004SH@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:56 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from web9601.mail.yahoo.com (web9601.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.129.180]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 15:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [205.182.107.178] by web9601.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) From: Morgan Young Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <20010327090215.9042.qmail@web6301.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327204923.61686.qmail@web9601.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk are they NREMT-Paramedic certified or other? --- Trevor wrote: > IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a > quarter and attend refresher courses > annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care > areas. All are also NREMT > certified. We attend conferences and workshops like > other medical professionals. We > just work in a different spectrum when we are > deployed. We just dont get paid as well as > "Medical Professionals" > > Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT > Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor > > > --- Andy wrote: > > This has piqued my interest. > > > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and > IDC's > > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How > do > > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > > during deployments? > > > > Andy Thornton > > > > > > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > > Submissions To: > wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text > Do not reproduce without author's express > permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe > wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: > Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu ===== Richard Morgan Young, EMT-P theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com permanent Email Address My ICQ Number is13139183. The Enemy is anybody who is going to get you Killed, No matter which side he is on. -Joseph Heller "If your going to Dance with disaster you might as well lead." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OSUR29JG0004SC@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:12 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:45:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from inago.swcp.com (inago.swcp.com [198.59.115.17]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:44:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (tanman@localhost) by inago.swcp.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA24084 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:38:28 -0700 (MST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:38:28 -0700 (MST) From: TANMAN Subject: W-EMED Is there a Digest In-reply-to: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC38D@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Precedence: bulk X-Authentication-warning: inago.swcp.com: tanman owned process doing -bs Is there a Digest form for Wilderness Medicine? And can you give the instructions? Thanks, Thomas A. Naegele, DO Email Albuquerque, New Mexico __________________________________________________________________ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OS2BHC3400PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:22:17 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:21:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:21:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2RF8x726660 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2RF8xZ26656 for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:15:12 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 10:23:42 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: W-EMED Medics & Up to speed Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC38D@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk Andy, Military medics are allowed to work on us Military (Folks in Uniform) stateside and overseas during military training exercises IAW Military Protocols but not treat civilians (folks out of Uniforms) the same way or protocols. So if both my wife and I get in a car wreck on base they can treat me IAW Military Protocols and the wife through EMT-B/P protocols depending on the certification of the crew. The Army now requires its medics to complete and test out as EMT-Bs through National Registry. I took my EMT-B course though the Army, I am Field Artillery not Medical, I had an easier time with the course than the Medics and Corpsmen because they use to doing military combat protocols vs. civilians on the street and were always commenting why can't I tube that chest to reduce the sucking chest wound. The Army has a training program to provide every squad with one combat life saver. That soldier is trained in advanced first aid and starting an IV. They carry a combat life saver bag with IV during all training & deployments. So you have infantrymen, artillerymen, tankers to truck drivers and admin clerks who can start IVs and provide fluids. I believe this came about after the Falklands War which showed us (US Army) getting an IV started & fluids on board early help save lives. Different rules for different environments, kinda like WEMS vs. Street EMS. Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Andy [mailto:brannen@lookingglass.net] Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 8:47 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1ONGH5LC600PZUO@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:55 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp018.mail.yahoo.com (smtp018.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.115]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 08:10:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo109.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.145) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 13:10:34 +0000 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:10:29 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000001c0b6bf$4bc53cc0$916bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just for the record, I am not, and was not an IDC. But I did time as a combat medic with USMC. I am not a Marine, but I was in the USMC. Hard to explain to someone that has not been around USN/USMC. The Navy Corpsman (what they are really called) are kind of a combination of CNA & EMT-I. The Corpsman can intubate, do IV's and do Chest Tubes if needed in Combat to Marines or Sailors, but NOT to civilians. Corpsman also see Pts at Sick call, but their charts have to be reviewed by a Doctor, just like QI. They take care of the cold and the flu, and other small Family Practice stuff, it is More than they can handle themselves, they send them for a consult with the Doctor, who may be able to handle it, or send it on to a internist, or other "specialist". There is no clear cut guidelines on what a Corpsman can see, and what he has to send to the Doctor. Notice I am not calling the doctor "Doc" in the USN/USMC the Corpsman are called Doc, the Doctor is called "Sir", or "Ma'am" Anyway what a Corpsman can see, and can not see, is worked out between the Doctor and the Corpsman, based on the corpsmans Education, and the Doctor's comfort with the corpsman. Corpsman also work on the wards in Military hospitals, doing much the same type of stuff, under the supervision of BSN's. They do alot of Nursing stuff, and many skills. Being a Corpsman really prepared me for being a Paramedic. the big diffrence between Corpsman and Paramedic's is the Cardiac, ACLS, and Pharmicological aspects of being a Paramedic. Corpsman aren't allowed to give Drugs to Pt.s via IVP. They are only allowed to Rx stuff with a doctors actual co-signature on the Rx slip. oh yeah and the 2nd big diffrence between Corpsman and a Paramedic, 90% of a corpsman's Pt's are 18 to 20 years old, Run 3 miles in 18 minutes 5 days a week, and have no Cardiac History. this is just a broad overview, as I see it, and having been both a Navy Corpsman, and a Paramedic. Both are wonderful Jobs. -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of LNMolino@aol.com Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 22:41 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical under military doctors regularly. They actually see patients just as if they were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training. I'll ask in the AM. BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire not a member of the USAF. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just=20 for the record, I am not, and was not an IDC.   But I did time = as a=20 combat medic with USMC.  I am not a Marine, but I was in the = USMC. =20 Hard to explain to someone that has not been around USN/USMC.  The = Navy=20 Corpsman (what they are really called) are kind of a combination of CNA = &=20 EMT-I.  The Corpsman can intubate, do IV's and do Chest Tubes if = needed in=20 Combat to Marines or Sailors, but NOT to civilians.
Corpsman also see Pts at Sick call, but their charts have to be = reviewed=20 by a Doctor, just like QI.  They take care of the cold and the flu, = and=20 other small Family Practice stuff, it is More than they can handle = themselves,=20 they send them for a consult with the Doctor, who may be able to handle = it, or=20 send it on to a internist, or other "specialist".  =
There=20 is no clear cut guidelines on what a Corpsman can see, and what he has = to send=20 to the Doctor.  Notice I am not calling the doctor "Doc" in the = USN/USMC=20 the Corpsman are called Doc, the Doctor is called "Sir", or = "Ma'am"  Anyway=20 what a Corpsman can see, and can not see, is worked out between the = Doctor and=20 the Corpsman, based on the corpsmans Education, and the Doctor's comfort = with=20 the corpsman. 
Corpsman also work on the wards in Military hospitals, doing = much the=20 same type of stuff, under the supervision of BSN's.  They do alot = of=20 Nursing stuff, and many skills. 
Being=20 a Corpsman really prepared me for being a Paramedic.  the big = diffrence=20 between Corpsman and Paramedic's is the Cardiac, ACLS, and = Pharmicological=20 aspects of being a Paramedic.  Corpsman aren't allowed to give = Drugs to=20 Pt.s via IVP.  They are only allowed to Rx stuff with a doctors = actual=20 co-signature on the Rx slip.  oh yeah and the 2nd big diffrence = between=20 Corpsman and a Paramedic, 90% of a corpsman's Pt's are 18 to 20 years = old, Run 3=20 miles in 18 minutes 5 days a week, and have no Cardiac=20 History.
this=20 is just a broad overview, as I see it, and having been both a Navy = Corpsman, and=20 a Paramedic.
Both=20 are wonderful Jobs.
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf = Of=20 LNMolino@aol.com
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 = 22:41
To:=20 wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: = W-EMED IDMT's=20 & IDC's

At=20 McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical =
under=20 military doctors regularly.  They actually see patients just as if = they=20
were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics = training.=20
I'll ask in the AM.

BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I = am a=20 civilian contractor at McGuire
not a member of the USAF. =

Louis N.=20 Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com =

New=20 Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions = stated here=20 are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the = opinions of=20 any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless = otherwise=20 stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C0B68D.012ACCC0-- _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- X-cs: R From: Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP X-RS-ID: X-RS-Flags: 0,0,1,1,0,0,0 X-RS-Sigset: 2 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: reminder -- list posting restricted Reply-to: kconover@pitt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:24:53 -0500 A brief reminder. Posting to the list is now restricted to members -- to cut down on spam. AND, members may only post from the address under which they are s u b s c r i b e d. You may, however, s u b s c r i b e under multiple addresses to allow you to post from multiple addresses. Thank you. -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OLLSZIMG0004SH@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from darlington.k12.sc.us ([207.232.247.130]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:17:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from INTERNET-Message_Server by darlington.k12.sc.us with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:12:50 -0500 Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 07:12:24 -0500 From: Dan Plemons Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu id HAA02583 X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.3.1 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-disposition: inline Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk On another subject.....What do you guys use for training for working with Hispanic victims? I need some good sources..... Dan >>> brannen@lookingglass.net Monday, March 26, 2001 >>> This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1OESTQUJQ00RNSZ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from web6301.mail.yahoo.com (web6301.mail.yahoo.com [128.11.22.138]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 04:02:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [165.76.25.85] by web6301.mail.yahoo.com; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 01:02:15 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 01:02:15 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's In-reply-to: <3ABFF0F7.310BCD02@lookingglass.net> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <20010327090215.9042.qmail@web6301.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Precedence: bulk IDMT's are required to see patients at least once a quarter and attend refresher courses annually. Most work in ERs or in other patient care areas. All are also NREMT certified. We attend conferences and workshops like other medical professionals. We just work in a different spectrum when we are deployed. We just dont get paid as well as "Medical Professionals" Trevor J Correia, SSgt, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instuctor --- Andy wrote: > This has piqued my interest. > > By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's > get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do > they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice > during deployments? > > Andy Thornton > > > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1O5OUR4W800P5Q9@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:42:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-r13.mx.aol.com (imo-r13.mx.aol.com [152.163.225.67]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-r13.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.f6.8753a4b (4564) for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:14 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 23:41:14 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical under military doctors regularly. They actually see patients just as if they were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training. I'll ask in the AM. BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire not a member of the USAF. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit At McGuire our IDMTs are in and out doing "things" and they work clinical
under military doctors regularly.  They actually see patients just as if they
were a doctor in that case. As for what they get "beyond" a medics training.
I'll ask in the AM.

BTW, so there is no misunderstandings I am a civilian contractor at McGuire
not a member of the USAF.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_f6.8753a4b.27f173ea_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1NZHX0OHW00RNSZ@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:53 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.trailnet.com (mail.trailnet.com [63.71.68.3]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 20:44:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from lookingglass.net ([207.18.213.53]) by mail.trailnet.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-60892U4000L400S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:55:50 -0700 Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:46:31 -0700 From: Andy Subject: W-EMED IDMT's & IDC's Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3ABFF0F7.310BCD02@lookingglass.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win98; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-Accept-Language: en References: <000201c0b657$bb569ec0$ab6bb6cd@morgan> This has piqued my interest. By what has been said it appears that IDMT's and IDC's get training beyond EMT-Paramedic but what? How do they keep "up to speed" if they can only practice during deployments? Andy Thornton Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1NXL9TSI600R03I@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:50:19 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:49:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp016.mail.yahoo.com (smtp016.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.113]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Mon, 26 Mar 2001 19:49:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo083.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.171) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Mar 2001 00:49:14 +0000 Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 18:49:08 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <43.12868ac2.27eee033@aol.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000201c0b657$bb569ec0$ab6bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0" Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Navy has a simillar program, except they are called IDC (Independant Duty Corpsman) The most notable is the Sub IDC's they are the only "Doc" on a sub. There are many diffrent areas of the Navy that Corpsman (similar to a Medic, but not) serve, including the Marine Corps (where I served) and their is a diffrent flavor of IDC for each area that you are in. Everything from Subs, to Special Forces (Seals, and Force Recon) To small ships. and simillarly they are not allowed to do as near as much in the US, as they are at Sea. To Bad. -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of LNMolino@aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 23:46 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. They have a slew of training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients" in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant. They can write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any civilian scope of practice. When deployed on missions out of the US they are often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly. The USAF only has about 3350 active IDMTs at any one time. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The=20 Navy has a simillar program, except they are called IDC (Independant = Duty=20 Corpsman) 
The=20 most notable is the Sub IDC's they are the only "Doc" on a=20 sub.
There=20 are many diffrent areas of the Navy that Corpsman (similar to a Medic, = but not)=20 serve, including the Marine Corps (where I served) and their is a = diffrent=20 flavor of IDC for each area that you are in.  Everything from Subs, = to=20 Special Forces (Seals, and Force Recon) To small ships. =20
and=20 simillarly they are not allowed to do as near as much in the US, as they = are at=20 Sea. 
To=20 Bad.
 
-----Original Message-----
From:=20 owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu=20 [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf = Of=20 LNMolino@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 = 23:46
To:=20 wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu
Subject: Re: = W-EMED=20 Nasopharyngeal Airways

IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. =  They have a=20 slew of
training but can't operate unless deployed but then again = they "see=20 patients"
in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians = Assistant.=20  They can
write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active = duty=20 people and only
when filled in a military pharmacy and other things = that are=20 WELL beyond any
civilian scope of practice.  When deployed on = missions=20 out of the US they are
often the "doc" for the mission and act = accordingly.=20  The USAF only has about
3350 active IDMTs at any one time.=20

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI =
LNMolino@aol.com=20

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The = opinions=20 stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form =
reflect the=20 opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated =
with unless=20 otherwise stated herein. ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C0B625.70BC2EC0-- _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1MJ41SAB600QJ1C@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m06.mx.aol.com (imo-m06.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.161]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from Caverbru@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.e1.122f8a6a (4405) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:43:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 19:43:46 -0500 (EST) From: Caverbru@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10502 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Pennsylvania they are part of the EMT certification and we use them on our street ambulances, not to hard to put in. As someone said they are good for seizure PT and jaw trauma. Haven't used them in the SAR environment yet. Bru Randall --part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In Pennsylvania they are part of the EMT certification and we use them on our
street ambulances, not to hard to put in.  As someone said they are good for
seizure PT and jaw trauma.  Haven't used them in the SAR environment yet.
Bru Randall
--part1_e1.122f8a6a.27efeac2_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:36 -0500 (EST) Disposition-notification-to: sepaulsen@home.com Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LX7GD9KU00DW9K@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:36 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:17:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com (femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com [24.0.95.128]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 09:16:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from c1398152a ([24.17.16.8]) by femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.20 201-229-121-120-20010223) with SMTP id <20010325141650.FKME21537.femail19.sdc1.sfba.home.com@c1398152a> for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 06:16:50 -0800 Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 08:13:49 -0600 From: "S. Paulsen" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk It is true that the cribiform plate is at the back of the nasopharynx I apologize for my misrepresentation of the anatomy, the dilation technique is something I was taught years ago preceding nasal intubations and I don't know of the sources journal or otherwise. It is important to state that this is in combination with neosynephrine for its pure alpha effects and with copious lubrication, not as a general practice and not really repeated insertions. For instance if you started out with a mid size npa and went to the next size up to possibly allow insertion of a size larger et tube nasally. Obviously in the long run it makes for a better course for the patient if we can wean them from the vent with a larger ET tube in place. S. Paulsen NREMT-P Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFE7M1HU00DW87@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:39 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.43.12868ac2 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <43.12868ac2.27eee033@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician. They have a slew of training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients" in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant. They can write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any civilian scope of practice. When deployed on missions out of the US they are often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly. The USAF only has about 3350 active IDMTs at any one time. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IDMT is just that Independent Duty Medical Technician.  They have a slew of
training but can't operate unless deployed but then again they "see patients"
in our clinic under a doctor not unlike a Physicians Assistant.  They can
write prescriptions for 250+ meds but only for active duty people and only
when filled in a military pharmacy and other things that are WELL beyond any
civilian scope of practice.  When deployed on missions out of the US they are
often the "doc" for the mission and act accordingly.  The USAF only has about
3350 active IDMTs at any one time.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_43.12868ac2.27eee033_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFE9XC0Q00P33J@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:42 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m04.mx.aol.com (imo-m04.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.7]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.7c.1375bcc0 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:15 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngaeal airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <7c.1375bcc0.27eee027@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was under the impression that the only real contraindication of and potential danger for use of an NPA was in cases of skull fracture where it was possible (although unlikely) to actually "intubate" the cranium. I will be looking the "books" tomorrow. BTW, we carry a slew of them in our airway pack in the jump kit as well as plenty of lube. I've Never done one on a real person but understand when I work nothing bad happens to a base with up to 29,500 people on it, go figure? however, If I take a day off they notify the Base Commander of my absence. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was under the impression that the only real contraindication of and
potential danger for use of an NPA was in cases of skull fracture where it
was possible (although unlikely) to actually "intubate" the cranium.  I will
be looking the "books" tomorrow.

BTW, we carry a slew of them in our airway pack in the jump kit as well as
plenty of lube. I've Never done one on a real person but understand when I
work nothing bad happens to a base with up to 29,500 people on it, go figure?
however, If I take a day off they notify the Base Commander of my absence.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_7c.1375bcc0.27eee027_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1LFEDNLUO00ED2L@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:47 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from imo-m07.mx.aol.com (imo-m07.mx.aol.com [64.12.136.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:47:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from LNMolino@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v29.5.) id h.59.8a416e3 (18403) for ; Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2001 00:46:26 -0500 (EST) From: LNMolino@aol.com Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <59.8a416e3.27eee032@aol.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10506 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary" Content-disposition: Inline Precedence: bulk --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To the guy with 170 hours who thinks he's the equivalent of a First Responder in the States, 170 hours is WAY more then a First Responder in most states. NSC EMT-B is only 110 + CPR add in HAZMAT and ICS in NJ you get 150 pr so and POOF you're an EMT-Basic. Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI LNMolino@aol.com New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island. The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To the guy with 170 hours who thinks he's the equivalent of a First Responder
in the States,

170 hours is WAY more then a First Responder in most states.  NSC EMT-B is
only 110 + CPR add in HAZMAT and ICS in NJ you get 150 pr so and POOF you're
an EMT-Basic.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET
FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI
LNMolino@aol.com

New Jersey, a peninsula trying to become an island.

The opinions stated here are that of the author and in no way shape or form
reflect the opinions of any organization(s) that he is in any way affiliated
with unless otherwise stated herein. --part1_59.8a416e3.27eee032_boundary-- Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KXUJF8R200ORPE@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:25 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2OLCNm10263 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2OLCNZ10258 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:18:45 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 16:28:50 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC379@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk IDaho & MOntana SAR? -----Original Message----- From: Morgan Young [mailto:theonlymorgan2@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 2:54 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways I know what SSG & USAF means, but what does IDMT mean? Independent Duty Medical Technician? -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of Trevor Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 23:53 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways It all depends on what material they are made of. Like inserting a nasal-gastric tube often you will put it in some ice to make it more rigid for insertion. I am not sure which material s remain pliable in the cold and which dont. Trevor Correia, SSG, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instructor --- Jonathan Silver wrote: > Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? > > Thanks, > -Jonathan > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KUO509B800QQT5@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:58 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp016.mail.yahoo.com (smtp016.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.113]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 14:53:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from buffalo061.positech.net (HELO morgan) (205.182.107.193) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 19:53:40 +0000 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:53:38 -0600 From: Morgan Young Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: <20010324055230.17841.qmail@web6304.mail.yahoo.com> Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <000501c0b49c$1e465ec0$c16bb6cd@morgan> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Importance: Normal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-priority: Normal Precedence: bulk X-Apparently-From: I know what SSG & USAF means, but what does IDMT mean? Independent Duty Medical Technician? -----Original Message----- From: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu [mailto:owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu]On Behalf Of Trevor Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 23:53 To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways It all depends on what material they are made of. Like inserting a nasal-gastric tube often you will put it in some ice to make it more rigid for insertion. I am not sure which material s remain pliable in the cold and which dont. Trevor Correia, SSG, USAF, IDMT Yokota Search and Rescue Instructor --- Jonathan Silver wrote: > Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? > > Thanks, > -Jonathan > Do not reproduce without author's express permission. > To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" > as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu > Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:14:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KR6GH2ES00F0XT@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:14:12 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from Micron ("port 1076"@[136.142.22.84]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KR59UVY400QWZR@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu> for wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:13:09 -0500 From: "Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways In-reply-to: Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "S. Paulsen" , wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <3ABC9D65.20473.181E0E@localhost> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.12c) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Precedence: bulk References: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> On 24 Mar 2001, at 7:07, S. Paulsen wrote: > The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways > was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, > there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, > and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying > where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous > area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an > EMS legend, or maybe not. > Kathryn Park, WEMT There is a single x-ray of this that has been passed around for decades. As far as I know, this is the only time it's ever happened! Well, maybe more than once, but it was an NG tube, not a nasal airway. And I think the danger is overrated, especially if you aim the NG tube along the bottom of the nose, instead of aiming upwards (which tends to rip off the turbinates and cause bleeding). Yes, it looks as though you should aim upwards from the outside, but take a look through the nose with an otoscope or a mini-mag. (I recommend doing this before putting in an NG tube or performing nasotracheal intubation, anyway). You'll see a nice clear passage along the bottom and all sorts of bumpy pink things that like to bleed along the top. Pick the side with the bigger passage. Putting some lidocaine/neosynephrine spray in beforehand helps, and for NT intubation, sticking your little finger deep in the nose (gloved of course) for a minute, ideally coated with lidocaine jelly, will squeeze some of the swelling out of the mucosa and make intubation easier. Nonetheless, at our trauma center, we put NG tubes in orally in those with facial fractures (almost always endotracheally intubated first). Nasal airways aren't long enough to really pith someone, and can make airway management in a trauma patient a lot easier. I say go for it. --Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP http://www.pitt.edu/~kconover sent with Pegasus high-security email download free from www.pmail.com Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- X-cs: R From: Keith Conover, M.D., FACEP X-RS-ID: X-RS-Flags: 0,0,1,1,0,0,0 X-RS-Header: References: <6a.c682513.27ed7fdf@cs.com> X-RS-Header: In-reply-to: X-RS-Sigset: 2 To: "S. Paulsen" ,wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Reply-to: kconover+@pitt.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 13:11:06 -0500 On 24 Mar 2001, at 7:07, S. Paulsen wrote: > The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways > was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, > there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, > and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying > where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous > area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an > EMS legend, or maybe not. > Kathryn Park, WEMT There is a single x-ray of this that has been passed around for decades. As far as I know, this is the only time it's ever happened! Well, maybe more than once, but it was an NG tube, not a nasal airway. And I think the danger is overrated, especially if you aim the NG tube along the bottom of the nose, instead of aiming upwards (which tends to rip off the turbinates and cause bleeding). Yes, it looks as though you should aim upwards from the outside, but take a look through the nose with an otoscope or a mini-mag. (I recommend doing this before putting in an NG tube or performing nasotracheal intubation, anyway). You'll see a nice clear passage along the bottom and all sorts of bumpy pink things that like to bleed along the top. Pick the side with the bigger passage. Putting some lidocaine/neosynephrine spray in beforehand helps, and for NT intubation, sticking your little finger deep in the nose (gloved of course) for a minute, ideally coated with lidocaine jelly, will squeeze some of the swelling out of the mucosa and make intubation easier. Nonetheless, at our trauma center, we put NG tubes in orally in those with facial fractures (almost always endotracheally intubated first). Nasal airways aren't long enough to really pith someone, and can make airway management in a trauma patient a lot easier. I say go for it. -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KLWJTXBO00DW3J@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:27 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.citynet.net (mail2.citynet.net [206.101.104.77]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with SMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12966 invoked from network); Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:05 -0500 Received: from main.citynet.net (root@206.101.104.67) by mail2.citynet.net with SMTP; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:05 -0500 Received: from 63-146-20-181.citynet.net (63-146-20-181.citynet.net [63.146.20.181]) by main.citynet.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA09997 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:43:03 -0500 Received: by 63-146-20-181.citynet.net with Microsoft Mail id <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:34:24 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 10:14:39 -0500 From: "Stephen R. Mosberg" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <01C0B44D.FEB61080@63-146-20-181.citynet.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu id KAA26529 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Precedence: bulk Generally, suctioning out the intracranial contents is not good form... The cribiform plate is located at the TOP of the nasal cavity, NOT at the back of the throat. It is right behind/between the orbits. At the back of the throat is the upper cervical spine [C-1, C-2] and penetrating that [not easy to do] will have the same result as pithing a frog in bio lab [parenthetically, also not good form...]. Hence, correctly inserting an NP airway limits the chance of intracranial assisted ventilations [air heads]. The incident to which Kathryn refers involved a naso-gastric tube: a longer, more pliable device with a mind of its own and a tendency to go where it's not supposed to be. In fact, an NP airway may guide an NG tube down the esophagus and away from the cribiform plate. But I wouldn't consider this a field maneuver. A common mistake is to insert things UP the nose [toward the top of the head] which is incorrect-even in a nose as big as mine. Such insertions may eventually end up in the right place due to the anatomy, but not w/o significant discomfort and damage. The proper method is INTO the nose, toward the back of the head, parallel to the roof of the mouth. Normally, absent polyps and deviated septums [is that septa?], this part of the nasal passage is larger, allowing whatever device-be it tube, packing, spaghetti, or finger-to pass more easily. [Don't try this at home, boys + girls...] The NP tube is reportedly better tolerated by semiconscious patients who may not tolerate an OP airway [very useful for that snoring bed partner!]. If too long, it will stimulate the larynx causing laryngospasm or vomiting. It makes a good temporizing method for airway support. It is NOT definitive airway management. All my reference texts are at work but it seems the cross-sectional area of the airway provided by an NP is considerably less than an OP airway making bag-valve-mask assisted respirations more difficult although certainly not impossible. The NP airway is preferred in patients w/ trismus [spasm of jaw muscles] or neck/face injuries that preclude an OP. Given space limitations and a limited role for NP airways, i.e., that sub group of patients between awake + able to control their airway and those usually unresponsive patients who cannot support the muscles of their upper airway, I don't carry Nasal trumpets. It's not that they're NOT useful, but their limited role hasn't earned them a place in my airway kit. I've never heard of using an NP as a "nasal dilator" [which means nothing, as there are lots of things I've not heard of...], but empirically, it would seem that the trauma of successive insertions would cause more swelling than dilatation. Are there any references for this technique? Bleeding is a not insignificant consideration, especially if clots are aspirated. I might add it's usually somewhat difficult to determine which patients are prone to nosebleeds. Stephen Mosberg, M.D., DABFP NSS #20444 ---------- From: S. Paulsen[SMTP:sepaulsen@home.com] Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2001 8:08 AM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways <>The only drawback they mentioned in EMT class regarding nasal airways was that they weren't recommended for head injuries. Apparently, there was a case where one was used on a person with a skull fracture, and the airway got inserted in the wrong area...instead of staying where it should have been, upon xray they found it was in a dangerous area inside his skull, because of the fracture. This may have been an EMS legend, or maybe not. Kathryn Park, WEMT Whether the NPA would be affected by temperature would depend on what they were made of, I believe some are made of silicone based stuff. And as far as the use of head injuries, at the back of the throat is the cribiform plate, in basilar skull fractures this is often fractured also and if the tissue is disrupted the NPA can protrude into the cranial vault. I have used NPA often and like them because they are rapid and otherwise safe to put in. They can be useful prior to nasal intubation when used with Neosynephrine if you start out with a smaller size, lubricated with Lidocaine jelly and slowly insert that size and after a few minutes continue to work your way up to a larger size. It dilates the nasal mucosa and makes for a less bloody intubation and can make it more comfortable for the patient. I think the main reason for their being used so little is experience in their use and that there are so many other procedures taught in EMT classes that receive more concentration. Also I think we tend to go full bore in treatment, sometimes, late in the patients course rather than being more proactive and anticipatory at least in basic airway stuff. And a lot of people don't like putting NPA's in. There only drawbacks are initial discomfort and epistaxis if inserted to roughly or in the patients prone to nosebleeds. S .Paulsen NREMT-P Iowa Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb2i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.162]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:58:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KI9ZB3N400QIM2@mb2i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:58:57 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:57:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (usarc-fw2.army.mil [160.136.109.6]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:57:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from usarc-fw2.army.mil (root@localhost) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2ODiUg05323 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil ([55.125.1.251]) by usarc-fw2.army.mil with ESMTP id f2ODiTZ05319 for ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by arnetbridge1.usarc.army.mil with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 08:50:52 -0500 Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:00:57 -0500 From: "Chapman, Charles MAJ 78th TSD" Subject: RE: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Sender: owner-wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu To: "'wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu'" Reply-to: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Message-id: <5B0BEAD8AB92D311B6990008C75D951C8DC371@078divts-emh2.78divex.usarc.army.mil> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Precedence: bulk Well that depends on the type of material they are made of but you can put them in a bag and warm them up fast in your arm pit or another team members arm pit, I would not recommend using the PT for this though. Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan Silver [mailto:JSilverAMC@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, March 23, 2001 6:02 PM To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Subject: Re: W-EMED Nasopharyngeal Airways Does anyone know if NPAs lose any flexibility in cold weather? Thanks, -Jonathan Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu Do not reproduce without author's express permission. To unsubscribe, send the text "unsubscribe wilderness-emergency-medicine" as the body of a message (no subject) To: Majordomo@list.pitt.edu Submissions To: wilderness-emergency-medicine@list.pitt.edu -- End -- Return-Path: Received: from mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu (mb1i1.ns.pitt.edu [136.142.185.161]) by imap.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisimap-7.2.2.4) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:02:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (majordom@[136.142.185.20]) by pitt.edu (PMDF V5.2-32 #41462) with ESMTP id <01K1KIE2YTM800F0XT@mb1i0.ns.pitt.edu>; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:02:16 EST Received: from localhost (majordom@localhost) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.2.2) ID ; Sat, 24 Mar 2001 09:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from femail3.rdc1.on.home.com (femail3.rdc1.on.home.com [24.2.9.90]) by list.srv.cis.pitt.edu with ESMTP (8.8.8/8.8.8/cisls-7.2.